Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

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Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby shalkedeagle on Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:29 am

Hey guys, seeking some help here.

so I have an 08 SCK (but its barely that any more with the amount of aftermarket parts that are in it now)

so I am not really a good techie at all and never broke in to my systema for the past 2 years that I have owned it. But one of my recent team members is a REALLY good techie and I had him kinda show me the ropes the other day, break down my gear box clean it up put it back together etc.

well turned out that my mosfet was in horrible condition and needed replacing so I did that with a HSA code-8 micro.

I ordered it installed it myself, soldered the wires to the motor my self etc. after 3 painful weeks of having to resort to AEGs I had my ptw back up and running... or so I thought. I put in my gold cylinder go to dry fire it and it just makes the worst screeching and grinding noise I have ever heard from a gun... it does not even finish cycling it is just terrifying. but now I stick in my black cylinder and it seems to cycle and fire but it sounds different from when it used to. kinda like it is trying a little harder to shoot than it usually did with my black cylinder(as if I was firing my gold cylinder with an m140 spring in it) but still shooting. I then put in an m110 spring into my black cylinder and I can really tell that it is just barely managing. It did the same thing when I went to play at a field back in mid December, but we were out side and it was so freaking cold that I figure the springs were really stiff that the motor couldn't handle it, when I took it back home that day it shot like it always did.

possible causes of the issue:

when we opened up everything and cleaned it all my buddy said it had too much grease inside, he said that sometimes you can apply dupont teflon dry wax grease or something like that but he did not have any and said it did not really matter so it all stayed dry. could lack of grease be the issue?

I have also heard that different bodies have unaligned motor mounts and receivers and can cause grinding and screeching. I have recently noticed a slight wobble between my upper and lower but they have been the same ones I have had for the past 2 years. not really sure if that would be a cause?

I also ordered a modified MOE grip from powair6 and installed that not sure if that is having some sort of effect on the motor and how it lines up?

I am also not the best at doing solder jobs, is it possible I just did such a shitty solder job that it is not making a good enough contact to power the higher fps springs/cylinders

could it be that the motor has reached the end of its life. I sent it to HSA maybe 5 or 6 months ago cause I thought it went to sh*t then but they said my motor was in really good condition and that it had all the work/mods done to it by tack already?

these are just a few ideas that come to mind as a potential cause but I am not really sure and it will be a while before my buddy can look at it and I dont want to have to ship my gun anywhere again, or try to open it all up myself. does any one know if anything I said above is for sure the problem or can point out something else that may be the issue.

Thanks for any help
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby TK8456 on Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:54 am

This might be a gimmick on FCCs part but they sell 2 gearbox units and 2 motor units

The normal and the high torque

The latter is designed to turnover higher FPS cylinders.
It could be your motor and gearbox can't handle the extra torque needed to turn that hold cylinder dude
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby CxK-ArthurDent on Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:23 am

Hi,

Did you open the Gearbox ?
-if yes - in what direction are the fake holes in the sector gear facing ?
--> To the sungear or to the receiver ?
-are the gears of the gearbox easy to turn when the GB is out of the receiver ?
-How does the gun cycle without Cylinder ?

A lack of gease is always not that good for a gearbox .. you should really apply some kind of lube.
but remeber to use really small quantitys ..

i don't think it's the receiver .. except you changed something there ..
just add tome tape direct behind the front receiver post (on the upper) to remove wobble.

a grip can cause noise .. buts its easy to test .. just remove it or change it back to the original one..
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby Turtle on Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:26 am

I take it all worked fine with both gold and black cylinders befor?

The gearbox should have some grease in, dry is not good but they dont need a lot.

Ive never had my gearbox apart, never needed to but like any box you need to get things right or it could be too tight.

Then for the soldering..

A bad solder joint will have too much resistance preventing your motor getting enough electricity to turn properly.
Also check the brush's and brush hoods as when soldering to the top of the hoods you can leek solder into the hoods and prevent the brushes moving properly and making good contact with the com.

Any soldering issues will not make the thing screech but it could stop the thing turning over properly.
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby shalkedeagle on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:43 am

hey sorry I went on Hiatus there for a few days.

thanks for the help/suggestions so far.

@TK8456 that dosent make any since though because I have been using a gold cylinder with m130/m140 springs in it for the past year, now I cant even use m110 springs? its not a problem of needing high torque gears/motor... something is just wrong

@ CxK-ArthurDent like I mentioned we did open the gear box clean everything of grease and put it back together.
the sector gear is put in correctly
the gun seems to cycle just fine with out the receiver attached
the gears are very difficult to turn manually(by hand)
I unscrewed and removed the grip to make sure it wasent a cause

@Turtle yeah like I said to TK the gun has worked flawlessly for the past 2 years. never had any issues like this before, I just wanted to open up the gun and clean and maintain it a little.

I pulled up the system SCK assembly manual and opened up my gearbox again and put it together with the instruction of the manual in hopes that maybe something was placed incorrectly before but it still does not work.

My techie buddy said he had the same exact problem with his 2 ptws with higher fps cylinders not working, he said he tried replacing motors, gears, pistons, he tried shimming the gear box up thinking the teeth maybe were not catching on the cylinder... none of it ever worked so he just sold all his stuff and got a polarstar lol

any other suggestions out there before I decide that I just need retire my gun until I can afford to send it out and get serviced by HSA or Tack
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby TK8456 on Fri Jan 18, 2013 10:47 am

Sorry dude, it's just I thought you said you're M90 worked fine?
So I thought it could be something like that.

Hope you solve it soon
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby shalkedeagle on Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:31 pm

lol let me try to clear this up in a much less confusing way... up until 3 weeks ago the gun shot mostly fine. it shot BOTH my stock black cylinder, stock gold cylinder, and m140 spring in the gold cylinder. then we opened up the GB and cleaned it at it STILL SHOOTS the m90 stock black cylinder. it DOES NOT SHOOT the stock gold cylinder or the gold cylinder with the m140 spring in it. it just screeches and grinds.

In order to TROUBLE SHOOT the gold cylinder to see if it was the cause of the problem, and see if the piston may be stripped, I took the stock gold cylinder spring and put it into the black cylinder since (we know it works in stock form and that the piston is not stripped). at that point the black cylinder WAS NOT WORKING with the higher FPS spring. this test simply goes to show that the cylinders nor the pistons in them are the issue. it is either something wrong with the gearbox or the motor
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby Tackleberry on Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:08 pm

Going back to your original post you mentioned you had replaced one of the FET's.

If you have not fitted the correct value FET it would be like closeing the valve on a fuel line. Under low load everything fuctions fine, but as you increase the load more juice is required and this cannot be supplied. So the motor will not have enough poweer to move the stronger spring.

It's easy to blame things like the motor, gearbox and cylinder, but you need to look at the one thing you messed around with...........................the EL-003.

Fit a new one and you should find all will be well !
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby shalkedeagle on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:20 pm

Yeah my old mosfet had very worn out and chewed up wires and my buddy said that it was shorted out so I bought this one.

http://hotspotairsoft.com/catalog/index ... ts_id=5100

I specifically wanted a Micro because I just got a new stock and it does not fit the batteries like my old crane stock so I need the batteries in the buffer tube which my original mosfet was not allowing.

do you really think that this Fet is the cause of all problems tack? if so do you know if there is an alternative I can get where I can fit my batteries into the buffer tube all the way?
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby The Reptile House on Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:21 pm

Tac makes a shortened board from OEM electronics. That's what I use in all mine.
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Re: Systema wont cycle Gold cylinder for some reason?

Postby Blackwolf on Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:00 pm

Hello

" shalkedeagle " Update your profile with location please, forum rules

Regards

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